SF is a hard hero to really be good with. Sure I can play SF and own vs 3ks, but vs good players I just lose. I have 100 games on him and 44% winrate lol so I agree
He's not hard to understand; get souls, win mid, cs good, etc. But the items are almost always going to be different, etc.
the items are almost always going to be different
Pretty much like any other hero
Sf has a super versatile item build and razes make him innately difficult
Sure u can build sb and right click people but to play him at full potential u need to be good at the hero
razes are difficult? Sf is actually such an easy hero i can't believe somebody even said its hard. In fact all heroes that are not in the "complexity 3" tier are easy. Also as i have mentioned above, all heroes have multiple item choices, AM doesn't go for same thing every game btw.
Also what do you mean by saying "to play him at full potential"?
By the way you or anyone else who says that sf is a hard hero are so wrong. There's no "full potential" on sf. If you get lvl12 early and get a sb, you can kill anyone just by ulting on them. Late game he is all about getting ult off and hitting non stop afterwards. THAT IS THE FULL POTENTIAL OF SF.
Pretty much like any other hero
I disagree. I have never found a set item build for SF. When it comes to other heroes, like jugg, I know I'm going to go for early battle build (yasha, drums, aquila, diffusal blink etc) or farming (battlefury, manta, diffusal) it's almost always the same shit.
But for SF, I can go caster build, and the order is not totally clear; do I go blink first? Do I go euls? Situational. Do I go SNY first before the euls and blink? Do I need a vyse or an octarine? Is aghs legit here? or do I just go fighter items like sny > bkb? Do I skip blink here?
SF has a very versatile item build, one of the top heroes for that, I would argue. But if you can get it right, it really pays off.
Here's an example of a game I played as SF where I got some really funky items, but it really paid off and won me the game just because of my item build: https://www.dotabuff.com/matches/2466625553
If your saying sf has very versatile build then i can say am has a very versatile build too.
no u cant
u can build sb or lance or sny in terms of right click
or u can go euls or blink in magic
linkens
drums
bkb
butterfly
satanic
skadi
ac
bloodthorn
eblade
aghs
octarine
hex
pike
shivas
crits
and the order and timing of all of these
do u even remotely understand sf this patch
sf's build is not nearly as cookie cutter as slark or am who have set in stone paths
yes u do vary off this path game to game, but in most scenarios these heroes buy the same things
sf does not
u clearly have 0 idea how sf is played rn
even when u go right click its not just abt ulting and hitting
do i ulti for the dmg reduction and aoe?
shud i try to burst one person?
initiate through sb?
do i stay in the back/positioning
razes rnt easy
ur not on ur first game gonna hit all ur razes
its not THE MOST DIFFICULT THING IN THE GAME
no shit
but it does take some learning and getting used to
Nope, i can say that.
First off, you should never build blink eul on sf if your team can't carry your useless ass. You can buy sb to get free early kills. 5K or 2.7K?
Secondly, Your item list on sf is the ridiculous.
You do not buy drums, bloodthorn, eblade, shivas on sf. Because you threw all items you think are good on sf like a mess, here i will group them.
Magic damage only (Only try this if you know your team can carry you) - bloodthorn, eblade, aghs, octarine, blink, euls.
Right click (If you are not beta and not let your team carry your ass) - Linkens, bkb, butterfly, satanic, skadi, hex, pike, daedalus, sb/silver edge.
do i stay in the backIf you build the magic damage build other known as "the pu$$y" build.
do i ulti for the dmg reduction and aoe?Yes, but don't randomly use it in the middle of the fight.
even when u go right click its not just abt ulting and hittingIt is all about ulting and hitting, unless your team is farming jungle while you are pushing barracks.
shud i try to burst one person?What kind of fkin question is this? You don't hit one guy till his half hp is gone and randomly start hitting someone else.
initiate through sb?? initiate with sb? You buy sb to get free early kills not to start a fight lul.
its not THE MOST DIFFICULT THING IN THE GAMEI agree.
but it does take some learning and getting used toYou have to understand what items do and use your fkin brain.
Normal Skill Pro SF boys ^
he hasn't played sf vs anyone with more than 1 brain cell lul
#justarchonthings
Dude at least watch some fucking pro matches then share ur thought !!
This patche I see every sf goes for drum then other items
I like magic sf cause it's not boring just like right clicking
U satisfied when u kill someone with eul ulti
"...but to play him at full potential u need to be good at the hero" - Washed up, Dota 2 veteran, 2018
Seriously, no fucking shit you need to be good at any hero to play them at their full potential, why the fuck do you keep spouting obvious facts (also those 'U's are fucking cancerous kid). When you're 2k learn to listen to people instead of giving shit advice
Not every hero needs as much skill, so u cant reach full potential much easier
Guess I didn't get my point across my b
Anyway looks like I don't have to argue with friendly player anymore seeing as how he dissed himself
Alright here we go the roast fiesta.
Einhander, you have played this game for around 6k hours and you're still 4k. What a shame big boy. 43% wr with sf talking?
Medivh, you have played sf with drum only 1 time in 51 matches.
arinki, There's nothing to be proud of being 4k with 5k+ games.
Carmilla, why are you even here? To support a friend? Who is your friend? Oh, i forgot. The tempest double from a video game.
Alright we have the first beta here (washed up). Anyone else have their submissions?
Btw how did i diss myself? I just answered your answers and other random 4k 6k hrs noobs replied saying archons can't be right. None of them have any idea how sf is played.
My SF is way better than yours, dude. I even admitted as my FIRST post that SF is hard to play vs GOOD players.
Anyways, I used to be 5K. But I don't have the time to play a lot and be that high ranked, that's too much time poured into the game. I'm okay with my mid 4K rank for now.
Now you're just targetting people for being better than you. What the fuck's YOUR problem lol. You never had a point you just wanna start shit. Even the top #400 laughed at you.
ur literally so stuck in delusion i cant convince u otherwise so why even bother
even a fucking 7k player is shaking his head at u and u dont realize
whatever
sf isnt the same hero this patch as whatever the fuck ur used to
"o no theyre all roasting me for being wrong lemme stoop to their level to show how right i am"
xd
Can you guys stop fucking trash talking in forums and start to an actual discussion.
Jesus christ all people in here just trash talking and salty
the discussion is
sf has versatility in items thus is difficult to master
other nuances like razing and even euls comboing correctly etc
then we have 1 person denying this and everyone else is flaming him because he is wrong and he is being a douche abt it
He's not hard to master - it's just that in order to actually be really good with him you need to know how to play midlane.
Better players usually unlock his full potential. With a little practice razes and everything else can be learned.
What you can't learn with just a little bit of practice is something else :
~ Last-hitting, lane-control, map-awarness, farm patherns, decision making, itemization and probably something I forgot to add.
I can play SF decently for my bracket, would dare to say I'm above average for a 3k player when it comes to SF, but I hate to admit any decent high 4k or 5k player will play this hero better than me.
Learning how to use his spells and snowball is not what unlocks this hero's full potential. It's knowing matchups, and so many more things.
Lol to further prove my point, I just stomped a normal skill game with SF. Yet my sf win rate is 44% in 152 matches :D
@Friendly Player
You better shut your ass up
Everytime you say something, it's either an insult or bullshit.
If you're that good, prove it to us and grind MMR
lmao, i say whatever i want to say and you react to that saying i'm retarded, calling someone on internet who you never met retarded is questionable. Forums are made to discuss about something in dota, someone said sf is hard, i think otherwise, i will argue, why you have to be such a cry baby? 
There's one way to settle this!
1v1 SF mid tournament! I'll let it up! Lmao
Can this be watched? or just the replay to be made public on youtube or something. I think this will be hilarious
Idk why people coreallate mmr and hours played. Its not like you have low hours put in and have x mmr doesnt mean ur the shit.
Alot of people thinks that by the time they have a lot of hours they will be 9k monkas
Tribo, how old are you? I'm pretty sure most people understand what autism is. Enjoy your report by the way.
No one's a cry baby
U simply can't accept the fact that ur wrong
It's not even abt "o but I think he is ez that's my O P I N I O N" because ur opinion is wrong
Instead ur resorting to "no one is giving actual arguments and calling me names"
Why shud they repeat what I just said?
Why TF does it matter if u get called retarded, in fact u just sound stupider when u say "um but I'm not actually retarded I'm just on internet how u know I retard???"
Jeez
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Pls explain.
A pro said this in one of his stream.