u should always max ultimate, lesser rearm time = lesser time to being catch, also perma-dagger perma-chiken is amazing (fkin broken)!
also take in count that tinker needs a lot of space before travel boots.. 1 vs 1 he is a beast. but when start getting ganked and travel dalay a bit.. is hard to come back
good god the reason you don't max the ultimate is because you can achieve less with a lvl 3 rearm than lvl 2 rearm because you will have less mana to do shit, 100 mana for every rearm is really big until you have a gigantic mana pool because everything you do costs a ton of mana anyway
please don't reply if you're dogshit yourself, I asked this in order to learn something I don't already know, not to have people who have even less of a clue than I do reply
I checked the guides now, and there's apparently one guy who maxes rearm every 20 games or some shit and that might be situational as a safety net in some scenarios but you by no means "should always max rearm"
Ive got a question myself. Is the dagon, eblade build better than the aghs, aether build in pubs? Yes or no? And why?
I am pretty sure aghs blows dagon 5 and eblade out of the water in terms of damage you can deal to a team for the amount of mana and gold you spend on it so you should probably get it and also it is not countered by magic resist since damage is pure, not to mention that you can cripple a team of right clickers during a fight, forcing them all to manta/bkb/whatever at a time they might not really want to so from my experience playing against tinker I am way more scared of aghs than I am of eblade/dagon
"good god the reason you don't max the ultimate is because you can achieve less with a lvl 3 rearm than lvl 2 rearm because you will have less mana to do shit, 100 mana for every rearm is really big until you have a gigantic mana pool because everything you do costs a ton of mana anyway"
I'm bad tinker, but I play him from time to time. I can assure you skipping ultimate at lvl 11/16 didn't work for me at all.
Never seen players doing it, actually. The fast rearm provides you a lot. and with soulring after each rearm you will have enough mana to do a lot of damage.
@ Slim Shady
I think Dagon/Eblade is stronger when it comes to single-target damage.
I've seen guides aswell. Seems like a few players get lvl3 rearm at lvl 16.. Well. I'll give it a try a few more times.
I was about to say there's a reason why good players don't do it, and I believe doing things in the right way right off the bat is much better than doing something just because it can't be punished by bad players (like I've been doing from 1k to 3.8k as you know no kappa)
soul ring will give you a lot of extra mana, but it is completely irrelevant in that scenario because you'd have even more mana with one less level of rearm, if rearm costs 200 mana and you get 150 mana from soul ring, that's a 50 mana rearm, if it costs 300 but you get 150 from soul ring, it basically costs 150 mana, which is a 200% net increase in rearm cost, which is probably the logic high tier players are using
i got 500 tinkers maybe try
i fukcing never max rocket laser
i always max march and then laser or rockets ( depends)
maxing laser first is good vs like huskar sven etc
i always get lvl 2 rearm at 11lvl and seems i get my blink faster
lvl 3 rearm depends i take it when i got bloodstone before that never
my build is :
botle /travels/soul ring/blink/bloodstone/ dagon or shiva / ethereal or hex
aether aghanim is the meta eith aether u can use hex laser and dagon from 1k range
^
Bloodstone (and then shivas vs illus heroes) is really good if you can apply pressure without needing to instagib someone with dagon.
U take lvl 2 ulti pretty much every single time at 11 nowadays because the duration is 1.5 unlike 2.0 that was before and the mana cost is less than it was before so you can afford it way sooner. Generally gotta think how much mana you have and how much do you think you will need to farm the map/fight and skill accordingly.
i like going like 2 2 2 or even 3 3 3 depending how much are people running at me so i put more points into qw in that case
i almost always go 4 4 4 1, into 4 4 4 2 immediately
i get third rearm with hex usually
One thing to note is that if you tp somewhere you'll be turned to that side, so you can even tp into chrono/ice path/dot and blink out of it if you blink in the same direction.
march clear lanes camps.. 2 marchs can kil suports full and can kill all heroes in very early stage
bloodstone give mana mana regen then go for rearm
when buy bloodstone careful not to lose insta charges ( u die 2 times in row shit hapens )
next item after bloodstone:
1.Shiva and bloodstone together can clear 3 lanes without go base and some jungle ( care no one to kill u )
2.Dagon insta kill suport with laser dagon and if needed rockets , insta rearm again laser dagon rocket carry all that can be done in 5 seconds( i can do 3 4 sec but im used to hero ...)
anddd dont ever use quickcast( i think i cast normal almost like quickcast and is unneccessery for me)
not use it cause you need to learn fast cast and therefore you will improve cssting 10 active items on any hero and i think your fingers become much faster
don't randomly suggest people not to use quickcast because it makes you faster even if you are fast already
even pros use quickcast
and I didn't know it's really possible to tp blink out of chrono, though I thought it might be possible
quickcast are not for you when play 300 games tin ker then go
u cant tp out of chrono chakram puck first rot earth spirit stun waveform acid spray etc etc
don't take all the farm and make your carry starve , the easiest way to lose a game as tinker !
sometimes dagon laser kill suports pos 5 like sd aa etc point is afted u finish suport in 2 seconds insta rearm and nuke the shit out of
whatis important is position
usually blink aside ( left or right 500 radius from center of fight) catch suport then insta rearm catch carry or anyone u need in that situation ( sometimes u must laser their carry to miss important hits)
well i take all farm and win in 20 mi with tinker just use my team as army to base dont even let them eat just run and hit like real sparta:D
lmao check this normal skill game
https://www.dotabuff.com/matches/2805369601
https://www.dotabuff.com/matches/2787478616
2nd game 16 min bloodstone normal skill china doto hard doto
Honestly quick cast is a scam that too many people buy into. If you're not already good at the game the quick cast is disturbing. If you're good at the mechanics you can decide if it gives any edge for you personally. And for some people it does, for others it doesn't.
First get good driving a volvo and only the think if that super fancy car works for you.
My build mostly 1-2-2-1 and i wont up rearm if no travel cuz probably i always get my travel at 10-12 minute mark, then ill up rocket and laser cuz most ppl will run if saw march so it will dealt less dmg, 2xlvl2 rearm is enuff for clearing creeps, always up rearm so u can in and out fight easily.
My Items mostly null > bottle > travel > soul > aether > dagger > dagonlvl1 > bloodstone > dagonlvl5 and ghost > eblade. I think aghs is shit cuz usually enemy run if i spammed my skills when my allies cant even pursue them, so i prefer this or i can change dagon to hex, sometimes i bought eul or force also.
your skil magic build is legit cause miracle and sumail sometimes skill that way ( they usually save 2 3 points and when needed in that situation they skil what they need for kill)
but try like me maxing march and laser asap
rearm at 6 is ok dont skip it
happened to me iget travels but no rearm and waste alot time
when u have like 1700 gold, 300 more for travels i usually go my jungle and march 2 camps ( very often i stack them both ) and finish therd travels
Wonder if theres any value in a Halberd/euls/scythe build to just keep 3/5ths of the enemy team perma-disabled in fights
The flavour of the metagame is to have 3x laser 1x rockets 1x march at 5 rather than 2x laser 2x rockets 1 march nowadays. You don't skill at 4 and sometimes take the quick point in rockets if you need it for the kill.
At radiant you can try to stack the hard camps when playing from behind in lane(you probably already know this)
Could also be done with dire side at offlane hard camp. Start walking there around 46-48, then pull at 55, 56 if the spawn walks slower. Dire regular hardcamp stacks is too easily spotted and stolen by most roaming enemy heroes.
Also, lvl 2 rearm is almost always justified with the recent buffs to it on duration and manacost.
Would really recommend quickcast on tinker. dont forget you could use normal cast together with it as well. Plus try to setup your hotkey layouts for the best possible finger movements(minimal mispresses, easy to reach buttons etc.)
From what I see there is the single target eblade dagon build, the huge disable build with hex, and the team fight control build with aghs aether. From what I've seen aghs aether is the best, as applying blind to everyone is pretty nuts. Of course these things r mixable, like getting dagon after aghs aether, or fitng hex into the burst build. Pretty sure the full aghs aether build is bloodstone after that cuz what matters most (from what I've seen I cud be wrong), is keeping blind up as long as possible, which only requires mana. After that not sure, maybe Shivas to complement the teamght control, maybe hex or dagon cuz u lack both single target burst and disable.
Also from my retarded 1k experience of maxing laser and rocket before march u can't farm. I think tink needs at least 2 or 3 points in march before laser max.
I think you always get level 2 rearm at 11 currently, level 3 rearm is a bit more situational but you shouldn't delay it for too long. I think aether lens is a must have, even if you are going dagon the extra damage, mana pool and range helps a lot. I don't think dagon+eblade is really a build either you go for a dagon or you go for agha, eblade is kinda shit as it doesn't self-ghost, has a projectile you have to wait for compared to instant dagon/near instant laser and doesn't help with mana issues like a hex would at all. Bear in mind I don't play Tinker at all this is just seeing what others do/having tinker spamming mates.
u buy daedalus skadi bloodthorn dagger and kill pepol without pressing too much shit kappa
better start learning the game from the beggining after 3k games u seem u dont know how to play
when u reach the point u know the basics pick tinker
Ah Tinker :D
Well firstly what you're going read is coming straight from 2k bracket so you can ignore but i think i know the hero pretty well :)
Skill build
Most Reliable against pub 1-2-1-3-3-4-3-3-2-2-2-4 Yes with this i mean getting second rearm at lvl 12 or skip the max point rocket and get rearm at lvl 11 but i think rearm lvl 2 at lvl 12 is better
Points saving is crucial if you're playing competitive games with your team at local tournaments
So on competitive games your skill build would be something like 1-2-1 and save the rest till lvl 5; if no action is going around the map you can get rearm at 6 and spend those saved point on march or if you have had some killing opportunities you can spend the saved points accordingly ( to kill one hero with support i tell ya don't underestimate the right click output from tinker and them base movement speed, so spend your saved points wisely coz i'd always prefer having march maxed by 7)
Why max march you say?
Well if there's any hero that can catch up with alchemist's networth in the game aside from naga i'd say it's Tinker!
How'd you do that?
MARCH MARCH MARCH!!
And if they decide to gank you at mid (which is most likely to happen! c'mon they fucking hunt tinker at 2k bracket at 3-4 mins =_=) trust me bro the march will always save you! even if it doesn't you'll get atleast one kill just by running around LOL
Why max rocket over laser?
Obviously Dota is a team game! yes you might get a lots of kill with the max point on laser but 700 damage (multiple target which is 350 per target without resistance) is just too much for anyone to handle in the early phase of the game and with rearm.. maxed rocket is like a nightmare!! what i'm trying to say here is that with maxed rocket your team will have a huge advantage in early fights but it's all upto you and how you decide to build your hero after all it's your game ^_~ Oh yea let's not forget the 2500 range!! Ah Double target sniper shot huh!?
Item build
Null + Wood Brance + Faerie Fire (Shared tango? nah you really don't need it imo but it's okay if your support decides to pass it on you but i don't think tinker will ever use the shared tango)
Followed by Bottle (1-2 mins) > Boot > Soul Ring (5-6 mins) > Travel (9-11 mins) > Dagger (13-15 mins) > Lens (17-19 mins)
(I don't mean you must get these items by this time .. it's just better to have these item atleast within this given time or earlier)
Now you've got all of your core items which are Bottle + Travel + Soul Ring + Dagger + Lens
Why Should I buy soul ring before travel? wasting 700+ gold and delaying travel?
Well you're not delaying it actually.. with bottle and soul with rearm at lvl 6 alongside with lvl 2 march, you're already pretty much a farming machine! Now you can double march the lane and have enough time to stack the camps doesn't matter if you're playing dire side or radiant (But i prefer playing tinker on radiant side more than on dire)
After you rearm the lane and go on stacking the jungle you might lose some exp from lane creeps but you'll get HUGE exp from those stacks which will most likely keep you +2 to +3 lvls above your contested mid laner in early phase of the game and as a tinker you couldn't ask for better
I'd never take a fight before i reach lvl 12 which is my goal lvl while playing tinker even my team calls noob on me but after lvl 12 i'd join every which I can
Never over extend yourself while playing tinker unless you're pretty sure that you can get a kill and make a safe getaway because fucking because one should avoid dying as a tinker just avoid it... with all those lvl advantage and being on top of the networth graph you're a fucking goldmine for an opponent.. they kill you even at 19 mins mark they get BOOM! 700 gold it doesn't matter if you have a streak or not if you've got a streak they'll harvest more!
Never ever think of killing heroes only!! Because as a tinker you can join a clash anytime you want and out too so your main focus while playing should be on farm but hey remember i never said don't join the war.. always join the war.. if there's a war going on! Hold your farming and join the war right away (Rearm if BOT is on cd and join right away)
Always Position yourself well don't blink out the common spot it's better to find your own spot to blink out.. i usually blink out back to our lane or behind opponent INSIDE the TREES.. it really depends on how the war is going on... winning position i blink towards them inside the trees losing position i blink towards our base (Hope you got my point here)
I'd avoid playing tinker against 2 heroes specially
#1 Spectre (Fucking nightmare)
#2 Storm Spirit (pretty much will mess up your item build)
And against a good Disruptor lol
Mid Game: This is where your skill really matters.. yeah like always Tinker will be farming and those vultures from the other side will on a Tinker hunt!!
If you're a 3.8k already I assume you've got pretty good sense of minimap awareness..
If you feel like no lane is safe smoke up and farm Neutrals
Fuck this shit is getting long.. leme end this quick with aghs or dagon debate
Opponents got heavy pushing lineup? Rush Aghs!!
You team doesn't have a carry hero and need to end fast? Rush Aghs
Your team got a pretty nice aoe disable? Rush Aghs
Your team got BH or Slardar? Rush Aghs
as you play along you'll know when to rush aghs after your core items
Dagon 5!!
1150 damage output every 1 sec! Isn't that op? (800 dagon + rocket 350 again without resistance, since rocket has no casting animation)
Oh i forgot the most important thing to mention above.. !! Try not to reveal yourself to the opponent on clash.. stay hidden most of the time & everytime you rearm you should find a new place to blink (unless you're on 100% safe spot) since casting a rocket will let opponent know your location and some smart people can really fuck you up..! And the only time I get rearm 3 at lvl 16 is the time i'm going aghs build if i'm not building aghs then i'll wait my bloodstone or hex till i get my rearm 3.. Rearm 2 is decent enough if you play smart and don't over extend yourself
Sorry for my bad english Not a native
Bonus tip:
Finally got my bloodstone ah! buy a New soul ring :)
BTW clock is tinks nightmare. Flare the trees to get vision, hookshot in, prevents blinking, blademail to counter his huge burst.
Clock comes online at lvl 6. A tink is sure as hell no gonna rush force staff, if he does his farm speed goes way down. Plus u can just buy one urself lol.
Well if you play tinker enough like 100 games you'll know only spectre and storm can rekt tinker since the early phase of the game.. i don't know how to explain the rest bro
*Peace*
how does storm and spec fuck tinker in the early stages of the game
storm doesnt have enough damage in one go to burst down tinker before he can at least send out two rockets, a laser and a march. considering how soft storm is, and the fact that vortex isnt skilled yet, i dont see tinker dying to storm. quite the opposite would happen i believe
and wtf lmao comparing tinker and spec in early, stop with the kush man
Spec is a counter. Just not an early one. Same with storm. I know clock isn't a problem late game, but the whole point is to shut down tinker early.
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What would you tell anybody who wants to start playing/spamming tinker, that would not just randomly occur to that person? I have a pretty good grasp of what the hero does because I've seen him in 234234234 matches already but I never really played him and I would probably lack the feeling or understanding to pull off a good tinker match even at 3.8k.
The things I've realized in general is stuff like blink queue into march for split pushing, soul ring abuse and not maxing rearm because it costs more mana, etc.