Sorry valve hasnt worked out mind control yet to take over the brains of people...... bet u dont come onto forums and rage wen other team gets idiots like this it goes both ways get over it ur gonna have idiots who throw or make poor choices in everygame in every country.....
im at 4,5k and this is supposed to happen? Valve can't prevent that, u are right. Cuz its shit company
@Jammin u play it so you know, right
Yes, i do play alot of dota. the only difference is i dont go crying off on a public forum every time i lose a game. if it makes you this mad i recommend finding a way of clearing your head after a bad game, i find theres nothing worse than having a horrible game and entering the next one with the same mindset, because then your rage increases exponentially. for me my head clearer is smoking hahaha
ye otherwise youlll be a dumbass like me eventually, and drop your dotabuff winratea by about 1 percent because you ruined games recentlly with loss streaks. I never used to post but if you let it get out of hand you will keep qqing and posting it to people who dont give a shit
@Jammin So you wanna say that i cry on public forum every time i lose a game? Stop being retarded, i never posted a thread like this before. And i'm not "crying" rofl, i just gave an example how retarded mmr is - having same fucking noob in team 2 games in a row who ruins the game on purpose.
Yeah na i didnt mean it like that it is rage inducing, had the most retarded team last night. Axe bane and sven trilaned and cut vs a sniper phoenix and a lich, fed the lane and went 4-15 in laning phase, then said they won lane vs 3. its just part of the game you cant get matched with people who play amazing every game solo que but theres still a chance that that guy wouldve been on the other team and you wouldve benefitted
as u can see we clearly dont need banlist and ability to see players mmr and scores in past 5 games just by hovering their in game name
hopefully one day valve will replace their logo with golden dollar sign hold by gabe
i still dont get why you complain so much about something thats free that you dont have to pay extra for. those who buy items dont get better matchmaking, they get the same trouble. theres always gunna be troubles with MM, people having bad games, bad mindsets etc, thats one of the bad things about playing team games with randoms, but if you win 50% and lose 50% then they obviously arent too far off the mark.
Ranked matchmaking is a farce.
See my 15 last matches played. In all matches, i was defeated because my allies feed. I lost 300 MMR points unfairly (compares my kills and deaths to those of my allies, the difference is very large). There are also players who earn MMR points playing poorly, that's why Matchmaking Rating should be based on KDA Ratio.
I propose the following:
The winning and losing players, win and lose respectively MMR points according to their KDA Ratio on the match.
+25 MMR points to winning player with highest KDA Ratio of his team
+20 ...
+15 ...
+10 ...
+5 MMR points to winning player with lowest KDA Ratio of his team
-25 MMR points to losing player with lowest KDA Ratio of his team
-20 ...
-15 ...
-10 ...
-5 MMR points to losing player with highest KDA Ratio of his team
Only then it would be fairer.
PS: Sorry for my bad english.
What a terrible system. People would be even less inclined to pick supports now. Suicidal split pushers would be less rewarding, everyone would just get dagons and ks or instapick spec and zeus.
^^ Yep, couse you play usually high-kda heroes, that have escape and tools to gank, lane to farm, etc... Hard to get better kda than a squishy support with no escape or farm... -.-'
I see that sometimes you are doing fine and your team sucks, but your system idea is retarded. Maybe adjusting 2-3 points compared to avg kda of the hero wouldnt be THAT bad, still worth suiciding on a support (getting 23 points is better than losing 23...) to save a carry, but it would still reward mid players and would lead towards everyone picking 5 mids/carries...
And btw better kda on a hero that has escape than your teammates kda sometimes just mean you played bad, not that you were that useful.
And heroes like Naga, Alch and NA which can be played in a myriad of roles will have a skewed average KDA distribution, resulting in pubs repeatedly playing those heroes in farming roles in order to rack up mmr points.
Practically any system not based on wins can be easily abused.
A system based on wins will occasionally have people who are carried by their teammates, but they can only get carried so many games before they eventually pull their team down.
stupid fuck he said it would be a terrible system and you bash him for playing carry/mid
daily reminder if ur kda isnt at least minimum 10~ as a support YOU ARE BAD AT THIS GAME
i am sick of seeing supports with mediocre kda who never buys courier and just feeds
Zenoth and Vaeldiithia:
Then, you think it's fair that there are players who earn ~25 points playing poorly or lose ~25 points playing very well?
Not only a ganker or carry can do a good KDA Ratio. A support hero can do a good KDA Ratio if assist as should.
KDA Ratio = (kills + "ASSISTS") / deaths
The formula of KDA Ratio does not discriminate to support heroes. As you know, you just need to give a hit for earn one assist. That's why, a support hero not need have skills like blink or invisibility for do a good KDA Ratio.
PS: Sorry for my bad english.
it should be based on what level ur dagon is because if you cant farm a dagon ur NOBODY
The problem is that a good kda doesn't speak much. There are 5k+ players with an average KDA of 3. There are 3k players with an average KDA of 6. It honestly means very little. Winning a game is not about kills.
Zenoth: "There are 5k+ players with an average KDA of 3. There are 3k players with an average KDA of 6."
It proves that Ranked Matchmaking is a bad system.
You gave me the reason about it.
PS: Sorry for my bad english.
must...................lv.................................my...............................dagon..............
This "f2p" thing is the reason i play dota2. I mean, there is no way i will ever buy something from Vulva and give them money for some hatz. If other players did the same, maybe Vulva would put more effort in their dead game.
And again bunch of 3 kda players came to explain how mm works, keep this up, kiddos.
PS I pretty like Jamming's posts, taking into consideration that he is 3 kda player in 3k mmr team. XD
^
noone is gonna take u srsly, we all know you have a shitaccount with 30%winrate and KDA's of 1-2.
@BraToS Well done on that axe game, similar build to mine and you look like you played it quite well. Kudos (will watch later)
@wave My Relentless-syndrome comes with me being at home and cant play doto for some days :D Ill heal asap I get back to my pc + work, dont worry.
The dagon lvl*5 points as MMR gain system seems to be fair, like it. I mean, wouldnt it be fun 10 heroes running around without boots but dagons? Should make an event of this.. :D
ON topic
About kda.... have you noticed my problem is not the K+A part of it but the / D? Then only count K+A and take int account tower damage, forget kills. Fair system, I like it. It doesnt punish squishies, feeders wont get k+a at all, so they suffer, but doesnt make escape heroes escape for better kDa before using all their spells/putting in extra 2-3 attacks... heroes without aoe get a % boost on their assists at the end to be fair.
@s a g a
The point is that kda doesn't matter. Ti3 average kda for carries was barely 3, gg scrub doto. Support kda was under 2. You should go ti4 and show them how its done.
Playing to win and playing for kda is very different. Any player can play for kda and easily get 4-5 kda per game, at the cost of alot of victories. It boils down to play style also. Mr. lie to me agen fagt has an average KDA of 5.58 on Riki compared to my 3.60, but I average 15.4 kills per game while his is only 13.95. The nature of the calculation means that aggressive players will often have far lower KDAs, even if they do contribute more to the game. Just one or two extra deaths heavily skew the calculations.
http://dotabuff.com/matches/524893710
Look at this game. My team was 15k gold behind and 2 lanes of raxes down. The pubs were busy throwing blame left right center. I could have simply avoided fights and lost with a decent kda, but instead I split pushed aggressively to pressure them back. Sometimes I would get caught as a result. My KDA for that game was 2.2. It sucked. But as a result I won the game, with over 700 creep kills in an hour and 15.4k tower damage. Surely by your logic it means I deserve to be in 2k mmr bracket, although I beat verified competitive players.
High KDA's can often times show little involvement or an opportunistic player who picks off supports in team fights then goes back claiming there was nothing more he could have done. This behavior is highly prominent in low-skill players and not necessarily based on MMR Rating though low-skill players are quite prominent in lower brackets.
@Zenoth: "Any player can play for kda and easily get 4-5 kda per game, at the cost of alot of victories."
Totally agree. It seems you did not understand my proposal. I don't try to create a system in which players with highest KDA Ratio earn MMR points, no matter how the match ends (victory or defeat). If you check my proposal, you will notice that the winning players will continue to win MMR points and the losing players will continue to lose MMR points. The difference lies in the amount of points earned and points lost, according to your performance (±5, ±10, ±15, ±20 & ±25).
Make it clear that I'M NOT IN FAVOUR OF A SYSTEM BASED "ONLY" ON KDA RATIO.
PS: Sorry for my bad english.
^
The difference between 5 and 25 is still too much... Just imagine, if someone plays for KDA, would still win more tha 20% of his games, lets say 40% if ones is enough good to win 60% playing to win, it would be still AT LEAST above 40% against same opponents... If hes playing for KDA, in 5 games 2*25 - 3*5 50-15=35 points for nothing. Even if only 1 win 4 lose, 25-4*5=5, with 20% win rate... Your system sucks.
Adjusting mmr points wint 2-3 is fine, not KDA, only K+A/teams_kills, and (discount from zeus' and spectre's assists), second highest have to be in 80% of the first, 3rd must be in 80% of the second, etc... If someone is out of this, have to do ~half the teams tower damage. If none of these are true, take away some points. Still not perfect, but already better than your idea. You can play around with the % and points, just wrote something down, can be it needs to be higher % or compared to first in team, but a learning algorythm could learn the pattern
This is your point that I was arguing against.
"Zenoth: "There are 5k+ players with an average KDA of 3. There are 3k players with an average KDA of 6."
It proves that Ranked Matchmaking is a bad system.
You gave me the reason about it.
PS: Sorry for my bad english."
I already explained earlier how your proposal was bad. This comment of yours insinuated that 3 kda players belong in 3k mmr while 6 kda players belong to 5k+ mmr. That is simply wrong. Plenty of high kda players have a low mmr PRECISELY because they play for KDA and not to win. In an evenly matched game the KDA of the winning team seldom exceeds 3-4 unless it turns into a one-sided stomp. Competitive stats backs up this statement.
Of course there are times you lose when playing well. There are also times you win when playing badly. But these cases are few and far between, and cause less problems with matchmaking than an easily abusable-system based on KDA or any other measurable component. For example if it was based partially on tower damage then my past 30 games with TB with an average of 10k tower damage per game would easily over-inflate my mmr.
wtf is it so hard to buy a 2-4 wards when you are playing something besides support?
If your shit team isn't getting the job done, do it yourself.
@OP, When that AM went mid, did you bitch and cry about it, or did you send a support with him so he could get free farm and completely zone out there mid? If a dumbass wannabe carry goes mid, then go with him.
@Vaeldiithia
On my system, the players won't play in order to just make a good KDA Ratio because they would lose 5 MMR points, anyway.
On my system, the players won't play in order to just win matches (current system) because they would earn 5 MMR points, only.
On my system, the players will play in order to win matches but playing well (good KDA Ratio). That is the ideal of any competition.
PS: Sorry for my bad english.
Unfortunately, my english is very bad to continue to argue my system.
Thanks to everyone for their opinions.
I understand the point you are trying to get at. However, this changes one of the fundamental objectives of the game. Fountain camping will become more common, and single target supports like bane will become less popular. It will change the way the game is played, and not necessarily for the better.
The problem is that you are assuming a high kda is a good indicator of how well you are playing. It is not.
Your english is understandable, so no worries there.
^^ Problem isnt your english, thats find, completly understandable.
People on your steam arent relevant, maybe some of them would play to win, some of them wont... playing for high kda is not playing to win. Playing with a stack would mean your supports will fall behind even if you are all on the same skill level, they will get 5-10 points per game and lose 20-25 points when losing, while mid/carry players would get 15-25 and only lose 5-10, so only from this you should see its retarded. You all won/lose that game together.
And KDA means NOTHING. Not just couse supports will have lower than something that can avoid dying by blinking away, also couse it doesnt take into account decision making. Some weeks ago I played a game where we had an Ursa, 4 of us giving getting him kills, all he had to do was autoattack and Roshan when we pinged hes up, even I had to buy his smokes/counterwards for that... He had everything. And he got fed, like 20-1-6 or something similar, as you can with that hero. And we all begged him to NOT GO THERE ALONE, WAIT FOR US, so he fed 2 times, and couse we gave him every possible farm, 4 of us couldnt defend base against 5 of them at that point, we lost the game. Also he had to go for some retarded item instead of bkb. His kda was abova 6 and single-handedly lost us the game. So he should lose least points why the supports doing their job and getting him free farm lose 20-25? You really believe it? And ist not a single case, it happens a lot, just not with this big numbers.
I picked this game couse the site mydotaskill.com choose the ursa as MVP, even being on the losing team. Couse from stats only, it seemd he was the only one on the team playing well. That site isnt even based on kda, it watches k and a, damage, tower damage and a lots of other things i have no idea about but it gave me a lot more points on games where i was useful and less when i was just standing there doing nothing and getting carried, so its usually a good indicator, but on that game, NOPE. So much from giving points based on stats.
Omfg, stop having butthurt - high kda means you're good, the poor majority has shitty kda so they want to think that it means nothing. But it does, kiddos. I was far better than average player in hon with higher kda than average one, here is the same.
Ggwp delusionsal folks.
^ Well as I could pwn you on the lane with my eyes closed, think how bad you are then.
And really, dont make me laugh THAT hard.
I see nothing "better than average" about your account in fact you are so painfully average its astonishing you would make a statement thus. http://dotabuff.com/players/19389719
The only thing that rides out about the others is Ursa who as we all know is incredibly difficult to play in a stack and requires "above average" skill to play. Looking through player history I see a lot of fellow wisp players, limited hero pool and Ursa runs (namely VanArt, Chris, Fadi). While understandably winning in limited hero pool does often give players the illusion of skill but I do not think this to be the case.
Source: I played a couple back then http://dotabuff.com/matches/308986447 http://dotabuff.com/matches/310341307
Having played those games with you it becomes apparent that beyond playing Ursa and finding your next stack you are stuck somewhere between mediocre and downright terrible as far as player intelligence goes. Your builds consist of 3 main items 1. Dagon 2. Shadow Blade & 3. Desolator your player page screams of game ignorance and that is probably among the reasons you have recreated your account (again).
Speaking along the lines of you being a terrible support and having a good laugh, your lion build with mana boots is always good for a chuckle. http://dotabuff.com/matches/525333703
Peace out fellow average player.
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http://dotabuff.com/matches/525387758 -> player "dunkincrisp" goes random anti-mage after 2 picks and goes mid like a fucking noob. SF makes fb and 2 more kills on him. Then he decides to ruin the game. In previous game http://dotabuff.com/matches/525362351 where i played with this piece of shit AGAIN - he picks jugger, goes mid and fails. Basically i lost 50 RMM points cuz of this faggot in 40 mins.
AND THIS IS WHAT YOU CALL RANKED GAMES?
Fucking piece of shit Vulva doesn't deserve to have the game named DEFENCE OF THE ANCIENTS 2. And you wonder why those fucking kids play LoL instead of DOTA? - cuz this shitty company cant handle a game like this.