i think he's just like any other carry really. give him a good start and its hard to shut him down. only difference is that its difficult to leave base with constant split push.
Phantom Lancer was always a strong carry. Its like saying is Anti Mage too strong. Any carry with enough farm will cause a team grief that is why it is in the best interest of a team to shut said carry down and constantly hound the base.
Any farmed carry is strong except void. Pa can 1 shot crit you. Pl and am split push and shit on your mana but void fails chrono and throws the game
I think taking away diffusal on lancer would be the perfect nerf
He can still build powerful items and his pushing is still there... takes away any earlygame snowball ability without a major nerf
"I think taking away diffusal on lancer would be the perfect nerf
He can still build powerful items and his pushing is still there... takes away any earlygame snowball ability without a major nerf "
The same is achieved by getting a bkb. Bkb blocks diffusal damage.
The thing you guys don't understand is ganking him 1-2 times during the laning stage is not shutting him down. Not at all. If you truly want to do that you will need to have an aggresive trilane which just won't happen if you are playing solo.
For PL's presence to be felt, he needs much more than a diffusal blade. He only really makes an impact with 3 cores and before that he isn't really gamebreaking so he does have quite a big window of opportunity to shut him down.
Nope. He's not much of a threat early, so the enemy has to be dominating a 4v5 fight for him to become relevant. Unlike Anti-Mage, PL can be ganked easily simply by buying dust.
If he's allowed to farm and get his items, then he becomes a problem. But the early game, he's defenseless and relies heavily on his team.
the problem is that diffusal on him is just too powerful. if he gets it early, its basically gg.
it's impoossible to win aganist him if i don't pick carry or just someone that can push good cause my teammates do not and then get owned by pl with diffusal and heart of tarrasque
^
translation: it's impossible to win against him because my team sucks
reason you are wrong: it's impossible to win against any hero if your team sucks
"translation: it's impossible to win against him because my team sucks
reason you are wrong: it's impossible to win against any hero if your team sucks"
That's not a reason that they are wrong. That's just not a reason that it's op.
I get fucking pissed when I lose to a PL cause my team never understands the concept of CONSTANTLY GANK HIM. FUCK. I hate playing against that DAMN hero.
I think the hero is not that strong. Really he needs so much in a skill level game. After his diff, he despretly needs to make a manta and heart, and if so, he is still killable with detection by any other well farmed carry. And many of the games, PL won't even farm those items.
But i must agree that his lategame is unstopablle, which makes the hero balanced.
http://dotabuff.com/matches/360239794 another fucking loss against that cunt of a hero. What patch was ganking removed in? I WARNED the team but fuck me right? What do I know?
Phantom lancer had everything to do with us losing that game. And Dorkly that wasn't a stomp. This is what a stomp looks like: http://dotabuff.com/matches/330472490
i watched your game out of curiosity and he actually was solo aganist skywrath who harassed him out of lane, yet he did not get magic resist until level 4 anyway
i's hard to think that you know it's not his fault and not just behave like a complete faggot to see people's reactions
Hey guys guess what. PL is not OP. Never was. Icefrog agrees with me because he didnt nerf him.
I've played a lot of pl games and he isn't that op, he's a super farm dependant hero, all the items he needs to build are expensive, both battlefury and butterfly counter him (building mkb isn't at all ideal on him since your illusions don't get truestrike dmg) he's a hero that typically doesn't want to build bkb. and is an expensive hero on your team since he will soak up a lot of farm from split pushing. the thing is you don't need to beat pl you just need to beat the ppl on his team and not allow pl to roam around and farm freely. if you are losing to pls with only a diffusal and yasha 30 mins in the game, you're playing dota wrong.
Says the guy with 82.14% winrate and 6.09 KDA on PL. Yeah dude we believe you.
A lot of heroes can shut down PL in the lane without resorting to an aggressive tri-lane, and they can continue to pester him around for most of the game, and this has been made a LOT easier now that tranqs aren't viable on him. QoP/Timber are extremely effective against him in the lane, and once they hit level 7 or so they can completely fuck with him. BH is the same, gets dunked in the lane if PL has support, but he just needs Phase Boots and he can keep killing a lone PL until PL picks up a Manta or a HoT. Not to mention just how scary other heroes are to PL once he is tracked he is super vulnerable.
He also can't enter team fights until he picks up a HoT unless his team is really far ahead, so many times I've seen chubby Alchemists/Na'ix/Gyro just walk into fights and wreck shit and PL can simply throw his nuke and run back to his fountain.
That's not to say that PL is weak later on in the game, but he certainly isn't unbeatable. He has his strengths, and weaknesses too, I find him balanced, and I'm not about to rethink my decision by looking at some shitty normal bracket match with AM + PA on the same team.
and what does that 82.14% winrate says to you? For me it sounds like - ppl are BAD.
I also had 80+ winrate on him, till i tried him 2 cm games, and noticed that he is so selfish hero. Lost the 2 of them ( one where i had ping +300, nvm) but it's easy to see that he is not that strong of a hero even if he wins pubs like hell.
And I completly agree with this guy above. Naix can farm a 14 minutes phase - drums - armlet, and just 1v5 opposing team, where can PL with the same farm, can only watch his team dying, dealing 200 damage per 10 secounds.
when you can make people rage from a 5 v 3 because you have a diffusal blade on pl i think there is a problem
Probably helps that you were playing in the normal bracket against 3 players with less than 50% win rate that never ganked you. Any decent players would have killed you 10+ times, with a simple SB charge + dust and someone else tagging along, you don't stand a chance.
But since we are on the topic of super low skill games
http://dotabuff.com/matches/188767190
Die twice in the first 10 minutes because top rune is warded and Huskar gets x2 Haste runes (although I hide on the first one so tower kills him after I die, Huskar was bot but tried to gank me quite a lot). Team feeds and most leave at around the 12 minute mark. so op le normal bracket game
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Do you think he's still too strong?